Motherhood is all consuming.

Having babies, nursing, feeling the fear of loving someone that much, and there's this baby on your chest, and boom, your entire life has changed.

It's a privilege of being your child's safest space and watching your heart walk around outside of your body.

The truth is, I can be having the best time being a mom one minute, and then the next time questioning.

My life choices.

I'm Lo Mansfield, your host of the Lo and Behold podcast, mama of four Littles, former labor and postpartum RN, CLC, and your new best friend in the messy middle space of all the choices you are making in pregnancy, birth, and motherhood.

If there is one thing I know after years of delivering babies at the bedside and then having, and now raising those four of my own, it is that there is no such thing as a best way to do any of this, and we're leaning into that truth here.

With the mix of real life and what the textbook says, expert Insights and Practical Applications.

Each week we're making our way towards stories that we participate in, stories that we are honest about, and stories that are ours.

This is the lo and behold podcast.

So, you know those Instagram reels or those TikTok videos where they show the stages of labor, but it's.

Based on someone's behavior, right?

And so you see people like chatting and they think it's so great, and then all of a sudden they're like, hair's messed up.

She looks ridiculous.

Like she looks like she's dying.

And clearly all the, you're supposed to think, oh wow, she's in labor, right?

Like baby's about to come.

And to some degree I think these are hilarious because they're true, right?

Like if you've had a baby and you've gotten to go through the stages of labor, you know that.

At the beginning, you feel better than you do at the end, assuming we're not having, you know, some sort of pain-free, orgasmic birth, supernatural birth experience, like it gets progressively harder and that then.

Changes the way you behave, right?

I wanna actually talk about that today.

And we did actually mention some of this in episode seven when I was chatting with you about pain-free labor.

so I wanna tag this on too, so that you can listen to the two of these together and kind of put it all together.

So that's episode seven and then this one.

Because this conversation today is going to be about those stages of labor.

And the emotional signpost.

And that's specifically kind of what I narrowed in on a little bit in episode seven and how the emotional signpost can really play into your labor pain and your labor processing and kind of how you're navigating getting through.

How labor often gets harder right as we move forward.

And so I'm gonna start by just going through stages of the labor, which it's probably gonna feel a little textbooky, which I apologize.

But also, if you don't know this, it's really valuable to know this because this is about making progress, right?

And so understanding progress and what progress means and what progress looks like is really valuable when you go in to have your baby and when those conversations potentially get brought in.

About whether or not you are making progress and what you're supposed to then do.

And then we'll tie that into the emotional signpost.

And you have to know that kind of textbooky labor stage stuff to understand the emotional signpost, because as you're about to learn, those are really intimately tied together.

One goes with the other.

So again, we'll jump into these stages first, and then we'll get to the emotional signpost stuff.

And then I want you to continue to think about episode seven.

Ideally, you maybe even listened to this before, and if you haven't.

Listen to this one, finish it, and then go listen to seven and you'll be able to see how you can start to put all of this together.

Okay?

So stages of labor.

There are four stages of labor as we go through meeting our baby.

And then honestly what comes after as well.

And while you may not know, this baby actually is born by the end of stage two, so all of our laboring and contracting and all, I'll call it the work of labor, though we all know things continue too.

Need work.

Things continue to be challenging even after a baby comes out, right?

So stage one is the majority of the contracting, right?

This is when we're going from zero centimeters to 10 centimeters.

And again, if you've had a child before, or if you're pregnant now, and maybe you know what your cervix is, you may already be dilated when you're.

Labor begins, right?

A lot of us go in and we know from a cervical exam that we've had done prenatally that we're already maybe two or three centimeters.

So it's kind of like you're in that first stage and things are already happening.

But we're kind of talking about here, stage one, like when labor truly begins to, so zero to 10 centimeters, that's all stage one of labor.

And we're gonna get into some divisions inside of stage one.

So hang with me for a second.

Stage two is from 10 centimeters until the birth of your baby.

So obviously you're still contracting during this, but a lot of people call stage two the pushing stage, right?

So again, we're still contracting, but often we're pushing with each contraction, our body's pushing with the contraction, however you wanna call that, or however you wanna say that.

And we're getting to the actual birth and delivery of the baby.

That leads us into stage three.

So your baby is born at the end of stage two.

So when we're charting, a birth at a hospital, that we chart each stage, right?

And so stage one ends right when you hit 10 centimeters, stage two ends like, you know, 12, 12 time of birth or whatever that time of birth is.

then we're immediately into.

Stage three, which is the time from birth of baby until the birth or delivery of your placenta.

And this one, you know, it has some ranges.

We'll talk about that a tiny bit more, but usually relatively short, right?

Maybe like 10, 15 minutes.

Sometimes it can be 60 plus minutes or so, but usually pretty short.

And you're not really contracting that consist labor pattern, though.

You will fill other things.

And again, we'll talk about that a little bit more.

Lastly, stage four is it's not always.

Fully recognized, I would say clinically.

But most people, and I think most providers are gonna say stage four is kind of the first one to two hours after birth or kind of after stage three ends, this kind of transition period for you and baby.

Your nursing care looks different because they're in and out of the room a lot.

They're doing fundal massages or checks depending on what's going on with your bleeding.

There's a lot of assessment of baby and their vitals, things like that.

And so.

Those two transition hours are often called the fourth stage of labor.

Okay, so that's broad overview.

Let's go through each stage a little bit, and just kind of put a pin in these because we're gonna circle back.

To this with the emotional signposts, like I told you when we started.

Okay, so stage one again is zero to 10 centimeters, but within that, there are three stages or phases, I like to say phases.

So the other things I just talked about are stages, and now we'll talk about the phases that are within the first stage of labor.

So this stage ultimately is all about contracting and dilating, right?

We're trying to get the cervix open and we're going to then push deliver, meet that baby in stage two.

So early labor.

It's often I'm gonna, it's often defined in two different ways.

It kind of depends on who you're talking to or maybe the hospital you're even at or your provider.

I'm gonna say it's zero to six centimeters.

However, some will say that it is zero to four centimeters, and then the active labor starts at four.

Now, the reason I'm saying zero to six is by the end of my time at the bedside we had, we kind of had this cheesy thing we would say in triage, which is when we're like receiving patients who think they might be in labor or.

You know, a lot of other stuff can be going on too, but definitely a lot of labor checks.

we would always say six is the new four.

And what we meant by that is four centimeters used to be this kind of standard.

If you are four centimeters when you're an OB triage, we're definitely gonna admit you.

It was kind of this vibe or this idea, and we kind of had shifted our idea more to six, like six centimeters is a true indication of labor.

And that was based on research, not just some policy we decided to throw in place in our triage.

But just some more evidence of like true active labor.

It's not gonna pause, it's not gonna stop.

We're on our way to meeting.

The baby is more indicated once you get to six centimeters as opposed to four.

So again, I call early labor a zero to six-ish centimeters.

Some call it zero to four.

But what comes after is active labor.

And I will say that some can split active labor, and that kind of lines up with what I was just discussing.

And they'll call active, early active, or late active.

And so early active would be four to six centimeters, and then that later active would be the, you know, the 6, 7, 8 centimeters.

And so all of that is active labor.

And essentially it's that middle chunk, right?

Those middle centimeters that you're dilating.

You definitely feel different.

Often the labor pattern has changed, the contraction pattern has changed.

Things are getting a lot more intense, but you're not quite at that transition.

You know that kind of intense moment right before in transition.

Of course, that's what comes next.

So that is the third phase of this first stage that we're still in transition is eight to 10 centimeters.

This one is the most intense.

It may feel like that giving up moment in this first stage of labor, it's usually short or overall, I would feel pretty confident saying it's usually the shortest one.

Of course, some people have like wildly fast labors and all of it's fast or whatever, but typically transition is going to be your shortest phase as you get to 10 centimeters.

So it's really short, but it is powerful as you will find out once you have a baby.

Or you already know if you've had a baby.

So those are the three phases within that first stage.

And then we move to stage two, like I already told you, and this is, we are 10 centimeters now.

Yay.

Your complete dilation and we're pushing, or we're delivering, or we're getting very close to meeting the baby.

Of course you're still contracting, probably pretty rhythmically.

Maybe it's every three minutes or so, because obviously we're gonna use those contraction efforts.

Your body's using those contraction efforts to deliver this baby, right?

Get them down through the pelvis and out.

then this one ends the moment of birth.

Like I said, first time moms.

In terms of timeline, this second stage can be like one to two hours.

It can definitely be shorter for others.

Personally, I had a shorter.

Second stage with my first baby.

So I wasn't the typical.

So it's not like you should expect to be pushing for two hours.

I've had lots of patients, clients, friends, students push for longer than two hours or be in this second stage longer than two hours too.

So I would say loosely, an expectation of one to two hours in this second stage of labor is normal.

That's a healthy expectation to bring in and then just understand, yeah, it could absolutely go quicker.

And it could actually go longer.

And those are both.

You know, safe scenarios or they're not atypical, they're just not as, I would say, textbooky for that first timer.

For second timers, the second stage usually gets shorter.

It's.

It's not always true, but often once you've pushed a baby out one time, your body is maybe a little bit more efficient at it.

If you do it again, you know what to do or you know what it feels like to push well or efficiently, and so often that second stage gets shorter and we have, you know, research and numbers to back that up as well.

I just feel like I always caveat that conversation with you may have a different experience, right?

Some people, the second stage is way longer with, you know, a second or third or fourth baby.

'cause maybe the baby's op or asynclitic or crooked or something like that.

But again, generally speaking, the second stage is often shorter if this is your second, third, fourth baby than it was with maybe your first baby.

And then the delivery of the placenta, like I said, it often occurs within about 60 minutes.

That's the stage three.

So after we are.

Done having baby, I hope they're on your chest and you have them right there with you.

You do still have to deliver your placenta and while it doesn't require a ton of like visceral, intense work from you, your body is still kind of delivering and you will feel some cramping and some contraction feelings, especially the moments right before it kind of detaches and separates from the wall.

You usually notice, I think most patients.

If they haven't been paying attention to what's going on, or you know, they're paying attention to that baby on their chest, all of a sudden they're like, oh, what's going on?

Often the provider can feel that detachment as well, or they might suggest, Hey, why don't you give a little push and the placenta will come out.

But that usually happens within about.

15, 20 minutes or so.

But it can take up to an hour, maybe a little bit more.

And that's going to be monitored like pretty well or closely by your providers, because we do want that placenta to detach we want your bleeding to be under control.

And that's kind of the stage of labor where.

A lot of this is coming together and playing out.

then lastly, like we said, that stage four, that immediate postpartum, I wouldn't put strict timelines on this, but it is often those transition hours and baby is out.

You're being monitored.

Baby's being monitored.

Ideally you're in skin to skin.

And just getting to know each other.

All right.

Overall timing for stages of labor.

Just if you're curious about the whole thing.

You've never really looked into this, so first timers to get through.

All of these stages.

I actually, let's leave out stage four for a second, but to kind of get from, you know, contractions and labor starting to, my baby's on my chest, they're out.

That expectation is about 12 to 24 hours for a first time labor, second time laborers.

I'm, I'm trying to remember the exact number, but I think it's more like a. Six to nine-ish hour range, or expectation eight to 12, so kind of more on the lower end of that first timer expectation.

Again, I know I keep saying this, you're like, yeah, I get it.

There are so many possibilities outside of this, and there are people who go super quick and they take forever, and how the baby's positioned or what's going on, or if there's something funky going with contract.

There's so many reasons there can be variability here, but first timers typically.

Everything takes longer.

That second stage, like we already talked about, takes longer.

The overall process takes longer, and then as your body's done it before, it typically just gets shorter.

One thing I wanna throw in here is if you are a vbac, let's say with your first baby, you ended up having a primary cesarean for whatever reason, maybe you labored and got all the way to 10, maybe you got to three centimeters.

Maybe it was a planned cesarean, but you didn't push and deliver.

Baby outta the vagina, right?

And so you had a C-section to deliver and meet your babe instead.

Typically, should you be attempting a VBAC your second time or a tolac, they are going to look at you, they being the care team, and kind of think about you as a first timer when it comes to kind of expectations of labor.

So.

Because you haven't kind of gone through the full like second stage and pushing process, the expectation would be that it might take you a bit longer, right?

Like it might be more like a first timer for a baby to navigate the pelvis, get through and deliver that way for you to get that vbac, your labor may take a little bit longer as well, because perhaps that first time, especially, you know, if you're a planned cesarean the first time, or let's say.

You got to four centimeters and for whatever reason they decided that a cesarean was needed or they called failure to progress.

There's a, there's a definitely a chance or a likelihood that your, your body hasn't done the full kind of process, the zero to 10 yet either, and so it may still just be like a first time kind of learning curve again.

So you are.

Obviously a mother already.

You already have the child from your first birth.

So I'd always like to acknowledge that because we don't wanna discount the wisdom that you bring into your birth process, right?

Because that is so incredibly valuable that second, third time.

But physically, the body may behave a little bit more like a first timer.

So when you think about your own timing and variability, if, if you had.

A cesarean with your first.

You might wanna kind of head your expectations more for your reback towards this could all take a bit of time as if it were my first time.

Alright, so that's little note about that.

So that is overall view.

Again, I said kind of textbooky about the stages of labor.

You have those four stages.

Most of your labor and deaf labor birth all happen between stage one and two.

And stage one is all those phases of labor.

That go back to kind of those reels and TikTok videos I'm talking about where we're showing the way.

Your behavior, maybe your clothing, whatever changes as you're moving through.

Usually stage one and then into stage two and meeting the baby.

Okay.

So the emotional signposts, and this is kind of the heart of what I wanted to talk to you about today, and it definitely does tie in again to those videos and those silly reels I'm talking about, which I've also done, by the way, on my Instagram.

So I'm not making fun of those people.

They're very real and they are funny.

So the emotional signposts tie in.

To the phases of that first stage of labor that we went through.

So if you recall, we have the early labor, we have the active labor, and we have transition, and each of those things is going to ask more of you.

It's going to.

Ask more of you, I think like mentally and emotionally as well, and the way you behave and move through those phases in that first stage is obviously going to change.

Right?

And what's really cool about the emotional signpost is that they directly correlate.

To the way that you are moving through those physical labor phases.

And the reason I think it's so cool and valuable is because so often labor can kind of get paired down to feel very physical, right?

Like what are the numbers?

Are you making progress?

Well, you're four and now you're four and a half, so your progress kind of sucks.

Like we can have these conversations that are so specific to.

What we can quantify, right?

What we can see on a chart, what we can see or feel with our hands.

Something that feels, yeah, more quantifiable and there's so much more going on in labor that is not quantifiable with some number.

And that's why I love the emotional signpost, because they tie into this.

Conversation and it's not some sort of cuckoo like, okay, this doesn't actually tell us anything.

I, I like adamantly disagree with that.

They do these other sides of labor, the emotional part that's going on, what we see in behavior is.

One directly impactful toward progress, but also two, it tells us so much about what's going on, even if dilation hasn't changed or effacement or those numbers that we just love to know and to see change.

Right?

So I feel like you hear the conversation a lot.

That dilation and progress, those thing, like, you don't know what's going on unless you, you are checked, right?

Like you get into triage, they're gonna check you.

Or if you're on Pitocin, they're gonna check you.

There's all the, there's all these, this is, this is how we say this is going well.

Right?

And the emotional.

Signpost of labor, I think you can say this is one of the tools or the ways that you can move through labor and say, I actually don't.

This is why you don't always have to check my cervix, or This is why I'm gonna say no.

Look at my behavior.

This very clear indication that I am.

Labor or that I'm a keeper in triage or however you wanna say that.

Okay.

So the first signpost, the emotional signpost, it correlates with early labor, so the zero to four, zero to six, depending on how you're looking at it.

But those earlier contraction typing and the signpost is excitement.

And that's why those videos, I think so often show.

You know, the chatting on the phone, calling your mom, calling your best friend.

I think I'm in labor, right?

You're putting your hand on your belly and you're like, oh, that was one.

That's so exciting.

You know?

And you're usually chatty, you're smiling, you're.

Probably restless.

I know everyone says to rest including me, you know, in my birth course I'm like, take a nap, rest, chill in the kitchen.

Maybe make some cookies, but don't think about labor, and that's super hard.

I've never been able to go back to sleep and I've been woken up in the middle of the night for three of my births.

Okay, so.

If that's you too.

I get it.

But you're typically, yeah, you're restless.

You maybe are taking photos, right?

Or that you have that, like, I'm gonna take a last bump picture.

You're just, you're thinking about what's going on, but it's not like it's taking everything from you and that that only thing you can think about is the contraction that you're feeling right now.

Okay?

So that's the emotional signpost, and it ties together with the zero to five, six centimeter dilation.

So what this means is.

You're in early labor.

This is great, and everyone can be excited around you.

Typically, we're gonna say, you don't have to rush to the hospital.

Yes.

Stay home.

Do whatever it is that brings you peace, that brings you joy.

Whatever it is that maybe you need to do, still do to get ready and just pay attention to how you're feeling.

Yes.

What your contractions do, and then how your emotions are changing, right?

Stay relaxed, stay hydrated, stay present, and yeah, I mean, enjoy it before it gets more intense, right?

So the second signpost.

Is seriousness, and this one I think is such a obvious difference and it often, I think, helps when you're triaging a patient that demeanor change when they come in and they are that serious.

It can be a really good indication, like, huh, she might be in more active labor than we think, or maybe she even thinks because of the way they're behaving.

So I think it's such a good tell that, you know, she's no longer.

Texting her mom in between contractions and she's no longer wanting to take pictures anymore, things like that, that she's focused, that the movements have become slow, that you can see the whole, the whole body is kind of focusing in on itself and what it's feeling, and that that serious isn't just, you know, like in.

Her face or just how she's like looking or speaking, but that you almost see this seriousness in the full body of the way.

It's embracing what's going on.

So that ties into that six to eight centimeters, maybe five to eight, whatever you wanna say.

So we're not at transition yet.

We're definitely not in early labor, but.

The ish is getting real.

You know what I mean?

And the body knows.

And so it's time to focus.

They're not gonna talk through contractions anymore.

You are shifting into deeper work, if that makes sense.

And labor is in full swing, and you are very likely.

This isn't gonna stop.

It's not false labor.

Like at this point, the body is going to finish doing what it has started and all parts of you, including your mind and heart, they know that this is often practically speaking, where it's time to really lean into coping tools, right?

Breathing, movement, support, making sure that environment around you is really the way that you want it to be, that you're cultivating what you can with that environment.

If you're not at the hospital yet, and that's where you're having your baby, you're likely.

This is like the timing, right, that you would wanna go because it's not fun to go to labor or go to the hospital and transition.

And I tell you that from personal experience, it's like the worst car ride, even though it's what, it's what I had to do.

Right?

And that's how we wanted to do it, to have our babies.

But.

This is, yeah, if you're leaning into these coping tools intensely, if you've felt that shift of seriousness, if your contraction patterns have changed, maybe closer together, stronger, all of that, it's very likely you are sitting in this active phase of labor and things are really moving along, which is great.

And that might be when you wanna consider more of that question of, it's probably time to go if you have not yet.

Okay.

Last signpost is self-doubt.

I, this one I actually think is the easiest to see self-doubt occurs during transition, and that is that eight to 10, like I told you prior.

It is intense.

It is powerful.

The body is moving that baby, making those final paces, taking those final steps down and out, and we are close and it is intense.

I have done it four times and I can tell you, I know the moment I hit transition.

Like every single time, especially more so maybe 2, 3, 4 now that I understood.

Oh, like this is what it feels as I move from early to active to transition.

And in this kind of self-doubt, again, that emotional signpost, what you often see is kind of a worry can creep in or maybe fear can creep in, definitely overwhelm.

Or if you're not medicated yet up to this point or you haven't got an epidural, especially, this is.

Nine times out of 10 or however you wanna say that.

This is the moment where you hear, I want the epidural.

I'm done, I'm done.

I'm done.

I'm not doing this anymore.

I can't do this anymore.

And if you've been paying attention to this mom, this patient, this client prior, you probably are going to be able to say, I know I hear you.

Like we trust you.

You're so close and you can say that with pretty good confidence because if that shift is happening like this and this self-doubt is hitting and this overwhelm is hitting that abruptly and you've watched labor kind of progress, it's a really good trance.

This is transition and.

This means baby is coming very quickly.

And so I think it's super valuable to know this.

This is what I love for partners, to know all of these emotional signposts and especially this one as well.

And then I would say, particularly with, those who wanna do birth unmedicated is, is understanding this point right here.

And this signpost is so helpful because that's when you can step in and know what's going on.

You can recognize it and you also know it's close and so you can.

Encourage in a way that lines up with what you, more or less, you know, to be true, right?

Like if we get over this hump, there's baby right on the other side of it.

And so you can encourage kind of with the right knowledge in your head of what is going on.

Okay, so I've been dabbling, you know, in and out of all of this, of, of why I think the emotional signposts matter so much, and I kind of just started talking about it.

But I do think it's so, so valuable for the birth partner.

And so in my birth class or when I'm chatting, you know, in Instagram or inside with my students or members, the conversation is always.

Like, send them this blog article, send them this link, make them watch that part of the course with you, or listen to the audio, because this is something they can definitely tuck away.

Right?

Okay.

They don't have to necessarily know all the numbers of labor.

Right.

Again, that quantifiable stuff is valuable, but I don't think it's valuable in the same way that this is so.

I would more teach them and want them to take this in and learn like, Hey, when I'm active and I'm chatty, yeah, you need to be there for me.

We're in labor.

This is fun.

This is great.

This is exciting.

But also this is early labor, so you can help me make decisions and choices based on that knowledge.

And then when you notice me getting serious, one, it's time for you to get more serious.

And two, that's probably a good.

Sign or signal that hey, things are happening, things are moving, maybe we should think about heading to the hospital.

This can help you answer that question of when do I go to the hospital, which is like every mom's primary question when they think about labor, right?

And you hear 4 1 1 and you hear 5 1 1 about the contraction pattern and that's valuable and that.

Is involved in this conversation, but is not the only thing, and I always bring the emotional signpost into that.

When do I go to the hospital conversation and question and answer as well.

So this is, again, that's, you give that to your partner, right?

Yes.

I know you're, you're tracking in my app and we're paying attention.

And the last, you know, eight contractions have been four minutes apart or whatever.

But also, what is my behavior?

And am I super serious?

Am I creeping into doubt?

Am I, do I seem overwhelmed?

Am I worried about.

When to go or not making it or thinking I can't do it.

Like, as they see these signposts, they can just support you, I think, in a, in a better way or a more knowledgeable way because they understand what all of this emotional stuff is indicating.

And then lastly, definitely when that birth partner or you know, doulas, obviously they know all of this as well, so they are so paying attention to this stuff too.

And when they see that self-doubt creeping in or that that overwhelm that I can't do it.

That is often when they know it's abs, it's just time to come around her.

It's time to make sure she knows she's close, she's safe, she's doing a beautiful job, that she can listen and still trust herself that what she's feeling is normal.

I think often there's a lot of like, I'm not a, like, I'm not okay in this moment.

Like, this can't be right and it's almost like it.

It is the re that you feel that way means it is, and so we can really encourage and support based on these emotions.

And we can put that together, knowing what's going on inside.

And so I love this education and this knowledge about the signpost for our birth partners because I think that it really helps 'em support us in a very beautiful way.

then the other thing I love about the conversation is just normalizing.

Kind of the intensity and changes that happen throughout labor that progress can be marked in so many different ways.

And I've talked about that a lot.

We don't have to go back through it, but that numbers aren't the whole thing and that the emotions can be actually a deciding factor and a helpful factor.

And I can share personally, I personally am someone who chooses not to do like prenatal cervical exams and things like that.

And I. Don't typically have prenatal exams during labor.

And I think when we teach about that and educate about that, a lot of the time we just make it seem like.

You just tell them I don't want any and that everything just goes well.

And, and, and they're like, okay, great.

But those cervical exams are so often used to mark progress, like we've already talked about.

But I think the reason a lot of times it can be very easy for a provider to be like, that's fine.

We don't need to do that right now, is 'cause what they're doing is they're watching your emotional signposts and then they can see your contraction pattern too.

So they're watching behavior and all of that, and these emotions they become.

Decision makers and we can lean away from, Nope, I need to check your cervix.

I've gotta do that right now.

And we can watch what else is going on and use those things to make, you know, maybe a decision as a provider or to maybe say, yep, she's definitely a keeper.

She's in labor.

I don't need to check her cervix.

And no, she's six centimeters to know.

And so I like this conversation for that reason as well, just to say, Hey, there are other ways we can qualify.

Whether or not, you know, you're in labor or what to do next if you are in labor, and maybe there's need for something else.

So with my daughter, I, I forgot I started to tell that story to you guys with my second daughter.

I just remember this so clearly.

I, I don't think I'm sitting here thinking backwards.

I've shared my first birth story.

In episode once, you can definitely listen to that.

I was checked once when I was admitted to triage, and then once at like nine, 10 centimeters I asked to be checked.

'cause I just was shocked at how quickly things had moved.

And yeah, that was it.

So I had two checks in that birth.

And then with my second, third, and fourth.

I was never checked and I went in, in spontaneous labor with each of those babies to win in technically, you know, for that potential triage process.

But each time the nurses, I feel like maybe they would tell you differently, but they were able to look at me and my emotions and my behavior and know, oh, I get it.

Like she's here, she's gonna have a baby.

And they did it without ever checking and knowing.

And so I think it's.

Sometimes easier to have that cervical exam for sure.

And maybe you want it and knowing you're seven is like, so encouraging and that's great.

Obviously you can have those and you can choose those and, and they can be super valuable.

But I think this is just those stories.

of mine are a good example of the fact that we can use this as a tool for admitting, for keeping, for progressing, and we don't always have to fall back on the cervical exam.

That is used really often, right.

All right you guys.

Let's put a pin on this conversation and wrap it up right here.

I think you get it right.

We have quantifiable numbers in those stages and phases of labor.

Those matter, those have value.

They can help us.

Indicate or be aware of labor progress.

Okay?

So we're not throwing those out, but what we are gonna do, or what we should be thinking about is combining them with these emotional signposts and recognizing that labor progress can be indicated in a lot of ways, and you can use the knowledge of that.

You can share this with your birth partner, like I keep telling you, so that both of you can kind of answer the when should we go?

What's happening next?

Am I doing well?

Am I making.

Progress.

You can answer those questions with kinda a more holistic understanding of what it really looks like to be moving towards meeting your baby.

As a note too, you guys, I do have blog posts on these both separately and specifically, so if you want to read more one more specifically or bookmarks, you can come back to it.

I'll drop those, show those in the show notes for you as well, and so you can kind of read more or have that to return to when or if you feel like you need to.

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